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[Brilliand]

There is one extra caveat in adventure mode: fast traveling seems to reset any countdowns before you can use an interaction again, so I assume that that could lead to some massive symptoms and very high infection rates if you're traveling with a companion who is ill. But why would you, though, unless your goal is to unleash biological weapons on a town.

Fast traveling also causes all syndromes that can expire to expire instantly, so my guess would be that it will result in the elimination of diseases, rather their uncontrolled spread.

[Halfling]

There is one extra caveat in adventure mode: fast traveling seems to reset any countdowns before you can use an interaction again, so I assume that that could lead to some massive symptoms and very high infection rates if you're traveling with a companion who is ill. But why would you, though, unless your goal is to unleash biological weapons on a town.

Fast traveling also causes all syndromes that can expire to expire instantly, so my guess would be that it will result in the elimination of diseases, rather their uncontrolled spread.

Right. That makes the expected adv. mode behavior as follows:

• Epidemics will go away if you fast travel, likewise any medical effects.
• Developmental disorders are unaffected.
• Permanent conditions like schizophrenia will develop new symptoms every time you fast travel, but also expire the previous symptoms.
• Plagues will develop new symptoms, are infectious immediately after every fast travel instance, and some symptoms (necrosis) will accumulate, some will not.
• None of this affects the adventure mode protagonist since you cannot at this time be forced to use interactions to acquire symptoms from being diseased. However, once adventurer control of your character is relinquished (retiring), any disease will manifest and be contagious as usual.

[evictedSaint]

I don't know if it matters all that much, but I'm still noticing some odd clustering.  My Blind Depressed Serial-Killer engineer just got 50 hammer strikes for the murder of 'Farmer' Unguerst. 

His blindness is labeled in the medical screen as only "Partial impairment."

Also, when my dwarves contract meningitis, and go unconscious, it gets spammed in the [r]eports screen.

"Urist McDiseaseburg has fallen unconscious x814
Urist McDiseaseburg has fallen unconscious x346
Urist McDiseaseburg has fallen unconscious x1024"

I'm using your most recent version, too.

[Halfling]

That should be just a very anomalous dwarf. Blindness and psych issues are governed by different switches so they shouldn't cluster even in theory, unless something is very wrong with the whole concept. Psychopathy and depression should have some clustering, with only a 0.02% a priori chance of having both psychopathy and depression, but a 20% chance of any given psychopath being depressed (psychology is still the worst switch here - for example with epidemics the similar figure is 5% rather than 2.5% of meningitis epidemic starters also having influenza, and developmental disorders and plagues are mutually exclusive and don't cluster). I've learned how to use c_variations more effectively now, so I think I could do away with the whole switches thing, and all the clustering, if this seems excessive, while keeping it easy to implement. Not going to do it straight away because at that level it doesn't bother me and requires rewriting about half of the mod. Thoughts?

Alternatively now that I think about it I could just make the psychology issues mutually exclusive too. There's no real reason why you need to have depressed psychopaths.


The unconsciousness spam, yeah. It happens, I believe, because syndromatic unconsciousness as I've managed to implement it is not a steady state according to my observations. Dwarves keep waking only to be put to sleep again by the syndrome. I was unable to make it stop. Now that you say it, it seems obvious this can be a performance issue if a large part of the population has meningitis and may fall unconscious for a long time.

In this thread Putnam suggested setting SEV high, but setting the unconsciousness severity absurdly high does not make a difference, except when it's high enough that it overflows it stops making them unconscious. Applying NOSTUN beforehand to exploit a bug like Meph suggested makes them stop falling unconscious altogether, while having them apply it after is impossible because the patients are unconscious and can't apply new tokens to themselves. Could make someone else apply it but I don't know that I could make it discriminate for just meningitis patients that are unconscious. Setting a NOSTUN effect start with a timed delay after the unconsciousness as part of the same syndrome resulted in the patients waking up and not falling unconscious again.

I also tried making it extreme pain all over - this might result in slightly reduced spam but does not make them permanently unconscious either, and combos similarly with NOSTUN.

If it's very bothersome, could cull the unconsciousness effects.

Anybody else, any help/ideas?

[evictedSaint]

...Well, that's odd...

Two of my insomniacs spontaneously developed depression and serial-killer...ism.
I had saved and was starting up the fortress, and they just...suddenly became depressed serial killers. :\

I don't know if it has anything to do with me reloading the game or anything else.

[Halfling]

Thanks for finding that. I think it could be a missing [SYN_CLASS:PSYCHOLOGY] which is supposed to be there after

[IE_ARENA_NAME:Psychology switch check test]
[SYNDROME][SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]

Yeah, saving and reloading can cause weird behavior by syndromes, and related issues do tend to escape testing by me, because I binge through forts and test things in arena... in another thread I had forgotten to add syn_affected_class which lead to the syndrome spreading to everyone upon save and reload. The exact issue I imagine could be at work here is if the cooldown is voided by the save and reload, then if you save and reload within 7.5 days after someone developed abnormal psychology, they can gain another form of it for free because the only protection against that was the cooldown due to the missing syndrome class.

Here's a full fixed interaction_psychology_switch file, can copy, paste and overwrite:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

interaction_psychology_switch



[OBJECT:INTERACTION] ## sorry, the annotations are currently just copied from noncontagious

[INTERACTION:SET_PSYCHOLOGY_BOOL]
 
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
 
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
 
[IT_REQUIRES:CAN_LEARN]
 
[IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS:PSYCHOLOGY_BOOL_SET]

  ## prevents repeating this
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]

[IE_TARGET:A]

[IE_IMMEDIATE]

[IE_ARENA_NAME:Psychology bool check test]


[SYNDROME]

[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]

[SYN_CLASS:PSYCHOLOGY_BOOL_TRUE]


[CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PROB:10:START:0:END:9001] ## PROB determines overall noncontagious disease frequency

[SYN_NAME:affected by abnormal psychology]


[CDI:INTERACTION:PSYCHOLOGY_SWITCH]
 
[CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
 
[CDI:FREE_ACTION]
 
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
 
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:90001]


[SYNDROME]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]

[SYN_CLASS:PSYCHOLOGY_BOOL_SET] ## makes it only do plague boolean once
 
[SYN_NAME:psychology pseudoboolean set]
  [CE_BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:99:START:0]
 ##insignificant effect that makes the syndrome permanent

[INTERACTION:PSYCHOLOGY_SWITCH]
 ## assigns a random illness

[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
  [IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
  [IT_REQUIRES:CAN_LEARN]
  [IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS:PSYCHOLOGY]

[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]

[IE_ARENA_NAME:Psychology switch check test]

[SYNDROME][SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]

[CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PROB:10:START:0] ## probability of noncontagious 1. The plague raws can use cumulative probability due to cross immunity - once a dwarf gets one plague, they do not get another and hence whichever gets set first is what they get. Since noncontagious diseases as I made them do not provide immunity, you must use standard probability here and not cumulative probabilty, or dwarves will get them all from a single source. Prob:10 here and 10 above gives a 1% chance per dwarf of schizophrenia, which is realistic

[CDI:INTERACTION:SPREAD_PSYCHOLOGY_1]
 ## yes, this is still needed. to make it not spread you modify the SPREAD_NONCONTAGIOUS interaction itself by removing the part about targeting others.
[CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
 
[CDI:FREE_ACTION]
 
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
 
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:900001]
 
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Insomnia]
 

[CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PROB:20:START:100] ## probability of noncontagious 2  
 
[CDI:INTERACTION:SPREAD_PSYCHOLOGY_2]
 
[CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
 
[CDI:FREE_ACTION]
 
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
 
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:900001]
 
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Depression]


[CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PROB:1:START:200] ## probability of noncontagious 3
  [CDI:INTERACTION:SPREAD_PSYCHOLOGY_3]
 
[CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
  [CDI:FREE_ACTION]
  [CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
  [CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:900001]
 
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Serial killer]


Later today, I'll try to confirm the problem, and if that fixes it, I'll update the upload. And if it doesn't I'll figure it out.

[evictedSaint]

Your "fixed" interaction_psychology_switch file is, quite literally, identical to the previous file.  I used a online text-comparer tool and it is the exact same as the file I've already downloaded.  Did you accidentally paste the wrong one?

[Halfling]

Your "fixed" interaction_psychology_switch file is, quite literally, identical to the previous file.  I used a online text-comparer tool and it is the exact same as the file I've already downloaded.  Did you accidentally paste the wrong one?

Yes. Yes I did. I'm such a ditz I'll just get a tattoo of bubbles this weekend. Was in a hurry though.

Anyway, what I was trying to do there wasn't working at all. Your issue is confirmed, serial killers do immediately gain all other forms of abnormal psychology if you save and reload. My idea there was not the cause.

Furthermore I thought the switches would make this stuff easier to read but it's actually a pain and confusing to go through all the raws. So I'm just going to rewrite all this with matryoshka creature variations and remove the switches, also removing all clustering and hopefully this issue too since that's where it obviously is. I'll upload the new raws later at a new DFFD.

[Halfling]

Fixed version up! Did away with all the switches. It seemed like 90% of the problem pretty much every single problem reported were those. It wasn't that much work after all, just wrote a script to do it.

New files at http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7818 !

This should eliminate all the above problems even in theory. It could have new bugs and needs playtesting, but looks promising.



New name of the game:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_DEPRESSION]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_BLACK_PLAGUE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_BUBONIC_PLAGUE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_SMALLPOX]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_INFLUENZA]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_MENINGITIS]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_PNEUMONITIS]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_BLOOD_PRESSURE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_SCHIZOPHRENIA]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_LIVER_CANCER]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_GIGANTISM]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_DWARFISM]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_BLINDNESS]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_INSOMNIA]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:HAS_PSYCHOPATHY]

Looking back, that's how it should have been done from the start, but I didn't know enough about how useful creature variations can be. Too bad CV_NEW_TAG:APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION doesn't appear to work.

I also "officially" made epidemics less frequent because they were too destructive and annoying in fort mode for my taste, and fixed some typos that had managed to evade previous fixing attempts.

[evictedSaint]

What am I supposed to do with the .sh files?

[Halfling]

Hm, maybe I shouldn't have included those if they're confusing. Or should have written instructions about them. I just assumed people who don't need them would stick them into /raw where they don't do anything
If you've created a snazzy new disease that's in the same format as mine, you can run those (assuming you have access to bash) to add it to the files with the probabilities it prompts you for as you run the script...

I think maybe I'll just remove them from the download. This also gives me a chance to fix a design oversight that's there that I just noticed, that a dwarf may gain new illnesses out of nowhere after about 4 years in a fort.


Edit: and it's up. No need to regen world for this update, just changed some durations.

Serial killers no longer seem to get lots of other psychology conditions by saving and reloading, as expected.

[evictedSaint]

You left a "Note to Self" file in the download... >.>

[Halfling]

I am so bad at this


New: Found bug. Adventurer companions getting new diseases eventually. My script had made it rely on cooldowns instead of repetition preventing syndromes I had called "fake booleans" earlier. However, because cooldowns don't work in adv mode, this would lead to companions eventually getting one of every disease, except mutually exclusive ones like gigantism and dwarfism, if you fast travel around them enough. Funky. So I brought those back in. That unfortunately makes 12 new permanent syndromes whose only action it is to prevent getting same disease again later when it's been determined they don't get that per dwarf, now that the diseases are independent.



Also changed probabilities in a way to make DF need to make fewer checks (outer prob=small, inner prob=large rather than the other way) and changed epidemic numbers halfway back because it was silly getting to 100 dwarves without a single case of the flu.

Fixed version uploaded. This time hopefully without shell scripts, my personal notes etc.

[evictedSaint]

Companions are still developing diseases like crazy in adv mode.

[Halfling]

accidental doublepost