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[Jim Groovester]

End of Day 1

Dundun dun dundun

After the Terminators found nine pairs of boots, nine sets of clothes, and nine motorcycles, they faced the issue of the Skynet T-800s.

"You." One T-800 asked another. "What is your mission?"

"To kill John Connor." He replied.

The eight other T-800s turned their heads to face the Terminator, their expressions unchanging. They slowly surrounded the Terminator.

"No, I mean, to kill John Connor's enemies." The unlucky T-800 tried to clarify.

The eight T-800s pulled guns from the their leather jackets and unloaded on the unlucky Terminator, blowing his cybernetic head off its robotic body and tearing the fake skin off its face. As the red eyes began dimming, they examined the robotic skull.

"Look at this." One T-800 said, picking the skull up. "The serial number has not been filed off. This one was a Skynet T-800."

"Then that means there is onlyyyyyyyyy oooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnneeeeeee leeeeeeeeeeeeeeffff f f f   f       f            f       t." A T-800 said, its speech slowing down rapidly.

The Terminators' heads rolled forward as their energy stores depleted. At sunrise, they would reactivate, after they finished recharging.

However, Skynet had the foresight to supply its Terminator with extra energy reserves....

Dundun dun dundun


Day 1 has ended.

[1] LARD: Tiruin
[1] darkpaladin109: Persus13
[3] Epichighfive321: LARD, TheDarkStar, Graknorke
[1] Persus13: Epichighfive321

Epichighfive321 has been lynched. He was a Skynet T-800 (Mafioso)!

It is now Night 1. Night 1 will last until Friday 6:00 PM MST.

[Jim Groovester]

Day 2

Dundun dun dundun

The Terminators reactivated themselves to the rising sun. Their cold stares slowly examined their surroundings.

"This one has been terminated." A T-800 pointed out the remains of another Terminator. Its pieces were spread over a large area.

The skull wiggled its jaw and rolled itself to face the group. "The Skynet Terminator did this!" He shouted.

"Are you part of the Resistance?"

"Of course!" The head shouted. "Do you think if I were Skynet I would do this to myself?"

The T-800s turned to each other and considered the possibility.

Dundun dun dundun


Day 2 has begun!

Tiruin has been killed. She was a Resistance T-800 (Vanilla Town).

It is now Day 2. Day 2 will last until Wednesday 12:00 PM MST.

[Tiruin]

I'll be back.

Player-sync fail detected...
Reverting to backup system . . .
IC mode enabled.

((I terminated myself. Oh goodness. xD))

    Greetings proto-humans,
Today is the second day, and hopefully your energy has returned over the hours of diurnal "sleep", can't help John Connor if you don't know what they do, eh?
Given your get-up, your voice is your weapon--what does one do in a confrontation with no 'weapons'? Use your fists? That only gets people so far. Nay! In this situation, what does one do to learn about those around them?

    They speak, and they listen.

    Communication is the weapon of the people! Use it, or Skynet shall overpower you all.

    ...

    At least I don't have that itch at my back anymore.

[4maskwolf]

Initiating startup sequence...
Scanning for hostiles...
Hostiles not found...
Engaging seek and destroy...
Well then, LARD.  Killing off the "untrustworthy" IC's, are you?

[TheDarkStar]

I find it interesting that Tiruin was the only person going after LARD. Also, see all my arguments from yesterday about him.

[4maskwolf]

I find it interesting that Tiruin was the only person going after LARD. Also, see all my arguments from yesterday about him.

Is there a question with that accusation, TDS?

[Graknorke]

Okay first things first that flavour text is beautiful, Jim.

Secondly; we struck scum day1. That's pretty uncommon so we should make the best use of it. So firstly we should probably go over Solymr and EHF's read lists to see what they have in common and where they differ:

EpicHighFive321 - Me
Graknorke - No reason at all to believe scum
Mastahcheese - Fairly neutral, if anything I agree with Graknorke and he is leaning townie
4maskwolf - Seems to be inquiring for quite a bit of information, I guess I would lean neutral or town
LARD - Mostly neutral but I'm not quite sure
Darkpaladin - Not posting enough to read
The Dark Star - Mostly neutral read, nothing much that I could tell
Tiruin - Despite voting for me I'm gonna say he's a stand up guy, neutral lean, I think aggressiveness means he thinks I'm scum, It's not hard to tell.
Persus - I don't think he is giving false tips or helping us falsely, but I do think he seems to give off a scum vibe, with his position as IC I don't think anyone would look to him.

4maskwolf: much activity and hunting. Most likely to be town.
Graknorke: also very active. Another good contender for town.
Mastahcheese: isn't asking too many questions but doesn't seem too suspicious.
TDS: quite active. Probable town.
DP: seems like he's trying to avoid answering certain questions and doesn't make himself clear. Slight scum.
LARD: pretty much everything he says points to scum.
The ICs I'll wait until Day2 to get a good read.

Well, they differ in a lot of places. The only place they're the same is a town read on me. EHF thought that mastahcheese was townie, while Solymr wasn't really sure. EHF thought that 4mask was hard to read, while Solymr was very convinced he was town. EHF thought that LARD was neutral, while Solymr thought he was scum. Neither has much on darkpaladin for obvious reasons. Neither had much to say on TDS either, but EHF read him as neutral while Solymr read him as town.
So not much of a connectiom there apart from the one (alive) person I know isn't scum.

And speaking of the implication of there being not-alive persons, Tiruin was also killed. Which seems odd to me. The only people she was a problem to were EHF and LARD. EHF died, so it can't be for that, and LARD wasn't really in such deep water with Tiruin. It would have been quite possible for him to answer the questions she was asking, so that would be a massive overreaction and suspicion draw (not that that's out of character for him). I'm not ruling out LARD, I just think that it was more likely someone else. I mean, he was rather pally with EHF, but definitely not with Solymr.
So LARD, how would you answer the questions Tiruin asked you? Actually, I insist that you do. You're the only person with a personal motive, and sub-optimal attention-drawing decisions aren't strange for you, if you remember the start of day1.
Darkpaladin109, what implications do you see in Solymr/epichighfive having been scum all along? Is there anything significant about it being Tiruin who was killed?
Persus13, do you want to give any opinions of EHF's vote on you? I'm sure you were following it more closely than I was.
TheDarkStar, I noticed that so far you've never been first onto a vote. It's always been after someone else made the first move. Any reason why you haven't instigated and carried through with anything? Always soon after too, like you're copying what other people say.
mastahcheese

But if EHF turns out to be scum, if he's lynched, then you'll have some major explaining to do on his read on you, as I pointed out earlier. Because that looks far too much like scum buddying for me to ignore.

Well, that turned out to be true. Do you have any particular questions?

As far as I see it, EHF was just kind of... dependent on other people. Those votes of his at the start were quite telling of that, copying what other people post. My reads list was only a few posts earlier, and we know he read mine because he even said he agreed with what I wrote. TDS also wrote a reads list slightly before EHF's, but the names on his were in a different order. But I missed the ICs off mine (copied the player list from the OP, forgot there were multiple lists), so he can't have completely copied the list.
I mean, looking at it from a perspective that doesn't know I'm town, there's 4 ways that could have gone.

First, it was deliberate and I'm scum, which means that it was an attempt to make me look better. Not a good plan, but this is BM,
Second, it was accidental and I'm scum, EHF just couldn't keep a lid on his overwhelming adoration for me. This one would be unlikely, because scum have private channels of communication and I know I wouldn't let something like this happen.
Third, it was deliberate and I'm town, basically trying to implicate me as being scum to get me lynched or more likely to draw attention. This one I don't think is the case so much as the fourth, because it isn't a very good plan.
Fourth, it was accidental and I'm town, just a beginner error. This one I think is probably more likely than third because of how EHF was acting, but maybe I don't give him enough credit.

PPE: Ooh boy 4 new posts. LARD dogpile v2 is apparently a go?

[TheDarkStar]

Okay first things first that flavour text is beautiful, Jim.

Secondly; we struck scum day1. That's pretty uncommon so we should make the best use of it. So firstly we should probably go over Solymr and EHF's read lists to see what they have in common and where they differ:

EpicHighFive321 - Me
Graknorke - No reason at all to believe scum
Mastahcheese - Fairly neutral, if anything I agree with Graknorke and he is leaning townie
4maskwolf - Seems to be inquiring for quite a bit of information, I guess I would lean neutral or town
LARD - Mostly neutral but I'm not quite sure
Darkpaladin - Not posting enough to read
The Dark Star - Mostly neutral read, nothing much that I could tell
Tiruin - Despite voting for me I'm gonna say he's a stand up guy, neutral lean, I think aggressiveness means he thinks I'm scum, It's not hard to tell.
Persus - I don't think he is giving false tips or helping us falsely, but I do think he seems to give off a scum vibe, with his position as IC I don't think anyone would look to him.

4maskwolf: much activity and hunting. Most likely to be town.
Graknorke: also very active. Another good contender for town.
Mastahcheese: isn't asking too many questions but doesn't seem too suspicious.
TDS: quite active. Probable town.
DP: seems like he's trying to avoid answering certain questions and doesn't make himself clear. Slight scum.
LARD: pretty much everything he says points to scum.
The ICs I'll wait until Day2 to get a good read.

Well, they differ in a lot of places. The only place they're the same is a town read on me. EHF thought that mastahcheese was townie, while Solymr wasn't really sure. EHF thought that 4mask was hard to read, while Solymr was very convinced he was town. EHF thought that LARD was neutral, while Solymr thought he was scum. Neither has much on darkpaladin for obvious reasons. Neither had much to say on TDS either, but EHF read him as neutral while Solymr read him as town.
So not much of a connectiom there apart from the one (alive) person I know isn't scum.

And speaking of the implication of there being not-alive persons, Tiruin was also killed. Which seems odd to me. The only people she was a problem to were EHF and LARD. EHF died, so it can't be for that, and LARD wasn't really in such deep water with Tiruin. It would have been quite possible for him to answer the questions she was asking, so that would be a massive overreaction and suspicion draw (not that that's out of character for him). I'm not ruling out LARD, I just think that it was more likely someone else. I mean, he was rather pally with EHF, but definitely not with Solymr.
So LARD, how would you answer the questions Tiruin asked you? Actually, I insist that you do. You're the only person with a personal motive, and sub-optimal attention-drawing decisions aren't strange for you, if you remember the start of day1.
Darkpaladin109, what implications do you see in Solymr/epichighfive having been scum all along? Is there anything significant about it being Tiruin who was killed?
Persus13, do you want to give any opinions of EHF's vote on you? I'm sure you were following it more closely than I was.
TheDarkStar, I noticed that so far you've never been first onto a vote. It's always been after someone else made the first move. Any reason why you haven't instigated and carried through with anything? Always soon after too, like you're copying what other people say.
mastahcheese

But if EHF turns out to be scum, if he's lynched, then you'll have some major explaining to do on his read on you, as I pointed out earlier. Because that looks far too much like scum buddying for me to ignore.

Well, that turned out to be true. Do you have any particular questions?

As far as I see it, EHF was just kind of... dependent on other people. Those votes of his at the start were quite telling of that, copying what other people post. My reads list was only a few posts earlier, and we know he read mine because he even said he agreed with what I wrote. TDS also wrote a reads list slightly before EHF's, but the names on his were in a different order. But I missed the ICs off mine (copied the player list from the OP, forgot there were multiple lists), so he can't have completely copied the list.
I mean, looking at it from a perspective that doesn't know I'm town, there's 4 ways that could have gone.

First, it was deliberate and I'm scum, which means that it was an attempt to make me look better. Not a good plan, but this is BM,
Second, it was accidental and I'm scum, EHF just couldn't keep a lid on his overwhelming adoration for me. This one would be unlikely, because scum have private channels of communication and I know I wouldn't let something like this happen.
Third, it was deliberate and I'm town, basically trying to implicate me as being scum to get me lynched or more likely to draw attention. This one I don't think is the case so much as the fourth, because it isn't a very good plan.
Fourth, it was accidental and I'm town, just a beginner error. This one I think is probably more likely than third because of how EHF was acting, but maybe I don't give him enough credit.

PPE: Ooh boy 4 new posts. LARD dogpile v2 is apparently a go?

I was convinced you were scum, but then I read this. You make some good arguments.  Eventually, I went through EHF's posts reminded me of his LARD lynch with no provocation.

To answer your question, I haven't carried through with a LARD lynch because I realized EHF was scum. I'm not going to carry through with it now, either, since he's most likely town. You also claim that I'm copying people, but look at the evidence I've found throughout the game.

For my first time through EHF's and Solymr's posts, here's what I got:

Persus13: EHF spent the entire day advocating a Persus lynch. Almost certainly town.

LARD: He might be getting bussed twice, or he could be not scum and just new. Unvote for now, because EHF's early vote against LARD makes no sense if LARD is scum unless it was a failed bussing attempt. Slight scum lean; we'll see what he does. He led an EHF lynch. Almost certainly town.

DP: He's mentioned in a negative light in Solymr's/EHF's reads. I'm not sure what to make of this, though, and he could still be scum. Null read for now due to inactivity, but someone else should look over stuff about him, too.

After this, I read through just about everything (it took about two hours). I think I have a good idea on everyone else too now:

TheDarkStar (me): - I was considered neutral/town by Solymr/EHF. However, I also helped get rid EHF and was one of the first to take action (in the form of an FoS and then just after that putting my vote on him).

This leaves 4maskwolf, Graknorke, and mastahcheese. I assumed that I'd be stuck and we'd just have to see.

Graknorke: He voted for EHF, but it could easily have been a vote to avoid suspicion - it was at the very end of the day, when his vote wouldn't really have mattered. His main stated reason was to prevent a tie vote, but what sane scum player would tie the vote so obviously like that?

However, he also gave some good reasons for his lynch that hadn't been mentioned yet. He's also been actively scumhunting and has a really high post count. I suspect town.

mastahcheese: He went after Graknorke for many pages. It would be a very bad scum tactic to go after one person that no one else sees as scum. He might have focused on one person, but he was actively scumhunting and picking the unpopular side. He's probably town.

This leaves one person (unless DP is scum, but I kind of doubt that):

4maskwolf: I just read over all your posts, and the content bugs me. Specifically the lack of any scumhunting or serious votes. You ask questions, but it's mostly the type of question you see at the start of the game. Solymr said you were most likely to be town and that you were doing lots of scumhunting. EHF said that you asked lots of questions and that you were neutral/town. Also, following Solymr's unexplained FoS on LARD, you quote his post while listing your read on him as null because "he hasn't done anything towny or scummy yet." (see this post: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=136649.msg5051740#msg5051740) For this reason, I'm definately voting for 4maskwolf.

Why did you excuse Solymr? Why have you not seriously voted yet? Why haven't you done any questions other than "What's going on?" and "What would you do in situation X/ What would/should X do in situation Y" and responding to similar questions? Why do you have no scum reads?

[mastahcheese]

mastahcheese

But if EHF turns out to be scum, if he's lynched, then you'll have some major explaining to do on his read on you, as I pointed out earlier. Because that looks far too much like scum buddying for me to ignore.

Well, that turned out to be true. Do you have any particular questions?

Actually, no. I don't, you managed to already answer them before I asked.
Although personally, if I were scum, and I did something like that, it would have been for reason 3, something similar to that almost cost us the game last BM.

TDS:
You bring up some good points on 4mask, but you don't really acknowledge Graknorke's comment on your own behavior that much.
And you actually wrote a section about yourself in your reads, why?

[4maskwolf]

I'd like to start by thanking TDS for actually acknowledging my existence.

I followed your link, TDS, and find your evidence to be tenuous at best.  You want the real answer?  The real answer is that I'm lazy.

That's right, lazy.  That, and I was trying to prepare for several tests, get my game underway, prepare for said game, and win The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly.

So no, I didn't feel like taking this game seriously.  Nor am I particularly inclined to now, in the mood I am in.  However, you have managed to draw my ire with poorly worded falsehoods and half-truths, so I feel obligated to respond.

See, you accuse me of not leading any scumhunting or voting, and while I concede that that is true I have not seen you leading many votes.  You are as indecisive as ever, only moving in to strike when you think you have a clear target.  Previous votes are:
Random vote on Granorke
Random vote on Persus, followed by unvote
Bangwagon on LARD after others have been grilling him
Bandwagon on EpicHighFive
That is all from day one, and all that I need to see.  You launch two random votes and join two bandwagons and you have the nerve to call me scum?
There are many people in this game who have been doing little.  You picked me because you decided I was a threat to your power, TDS.  The others, of course, are LARD, and DP.  But of course, they are newer than I am, on their first and second games, and I'm sure you could come up with bullshit reasons to get them lynched, couldn't you.  LARD for his day one behavior and DP for general lurking.  So you focus your efforts on me.

Really, it's not that hard to see through your disguise.  You should really work on it.  You bus your scumbuddy day one to ingratiate yourself with the town and kill an IC night one to, hopefully, prevent yourself from being found out.

You put a lot of weight in the words of a scum, don't you?  That's part of your basis for lynching me.  Well, I'd like to point out something important in there:

Graknorke - No reason at all to believe scum

Now dead scum basically puts Graknorke out of suspicion by saying this, doesn't he?  Because it's so vague, hmm?  Well then, of course Graknorke is town, the scum said so, right?
No.  That's you rationalizing things.  You never state it in your posts, but you never bring it up, either.
I would like to note also that Solymr has a tendency to put people as town he thinks are playing well, regardless of if they actually are.  Graknorke is listed on his list as town as well, yet you don't go after him.

Oh right.  That's because he's new and you're the scum.  You're sure that he will slip up somewhere and give you an option to lynch him.  And if not, there is always the nightkill.

Another fact about me, and something that Mastahcheese can vouch for: I refuse to lynch new players on their first day.  I hinted as much in the scumchat of The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly, and it is the ONLY reason I didn't lynch Darkpaladin day one.  Yes, I voted Solymr in that game, but it was a stupid attempt to save my scumbuddy and I backed off when I remembered he was new.

So, scumbiscuit, what do you have to say for yourself?

[mastahcheese]

((Are you ok, 4mask? We didn't upset you, did we?))

[TheDarkStar]

I'd like to start by thanking TDS for actually acknowledging my existence.

I followed your link, TDS, and find your evidence to be tenuous at best.  You want the real answer?  The real answer is that I'm lazy.

That's right, lazy.  That, and I was trying to prepare for several tests, get my game underway, prepare for said game, and win The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly.

So no, I didn't feel like taking this game seriously.  Nor am I particularly inclined to now, in the mood I am in.  However, you have managed to draw my ire with poorly worded falsehoods and half-truths, so I feel obligated to respond.

See, you accuse me of not leading any scumhunting or voting, and while I concede that that is true I have not seen you leading many votes.  You are as indecisive as ever, only moving in to strike when you think you have a clear target.  Previous votes are:
Random vote on Granorke
Random vote on Persus, followed by unvote
Bangwagon on LARD after others have been grilling him
Bandwagon on EpicHighFive
That is all from day one, and all that I need to see.  You launch two random votes and join two bandwagons and you have the nerve to call me scum?
There are many people in this game who have been doing little.  You picked me because you decided I was a threat to your power, TDS.  The others, of course, are LARD, and DP.  But of course, they are newer than I am, on their first and second games, and I'm sure you could come up with bullshit reasons to get them lynched, couldn't you.  LARD for his day one behavior and DP for general lurking.  So you focus your efforts on me.

Really, it's not that hard to see through your disguise.  You should really work on it.  You bus your scumbuddy day one to ingratiate yourself with the town and kill an IC night one to, hopefully, prevent yourself from being found out.

You put a lot of weight in the words of a scum, don't you?  That's part of your basis for lynching me.  Well, I'd like to point out something important in there:

Graknorke - No reason at all to believe scum

Now dead scum basically puts Graknorke out of suspicion by saying this, doesn't he?  Because it's so vague, hmm?  Well then, of course Graknorke is town, the scum said so, right?
No.  That's you rationalizing things.  You never state it in your posts, but you never bring it up, either.
I would like to note also that Solymr has a tendency to put people as town he thinks are playing well, regardless of if they actually are.  Graknorke is listed on his list as town as well, yet you don't go after him.

Oh right.  That's because he's new and you're the scum.  You're sure that he will slip up somewhere and give you an option to lynch him.  And if not, there is always the nightkill.

Another fact about me, and something that Mastahcheese can vouch for: I refuse to lynch new players on their first day.  I hinted as much in the scumchat of The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly, and it is the ONLY reason I didn't lynch Darkpaladin day one.  Yes, I voted Solymr in that game, but it was a stupid attempt to save my scumbuddy and I backed off when I remembered he was new.

So, scumbiscuit, what do you have to say for yourself?

Honestly, your logic is hilariously bad. If I could vote for you again, I could.

1. You admit to being lazy. Guess what? A part of what I said was that you were trying to look active while not contributing. Everyone else except you and DP have contributed. You have RL going on, but so do I. I have school and I'm in two other mafia games, along with other RL things that come up from time to time. However, I still found time here and there to contribute. Why couldn't you?

2.I'm not accusing you of not leading scumhunting or voting; I'm accusing you of doing none at all (other than a vote or two in the RVS). Why did you blatantly misinterpret my post?

3. I don't actually have two bandwagon votes. One was on EPH where I was one of the first to vote for him - if I was scum, I wouldn't have voted at a time early enough to possibly cause a lynch when one could be avoided. I actually had a FoS on him before anyone voted for him (I still suspected LARD more at that point). The other vote was on LARD when I had been trying to get information out of him, too. Why do you ignore the two other people who did the same? Also, don't forget about my current vote on you.

4. I've already showed why LARD is probably not scum; did you even read my post?

5. You said that I can come up with reasons for voting for them, so I voted for you. This logic makes no sense; could you explain?

6. About Grak: Read the rest of my post please. I have reasons there. Also, the reason that I missed posting for him was the extensive scumhunt on him by mastahcheese that yielded nothing.

7. Not voting at all is a pretty good way to not vote new people, isn't it?

8. Several people were listed as town, actually. I ignored the town reads almost entirely because they were so common - except for the unusual one in your case that you were the "most likely to be town".

9. Why would I try even do this if I was scum? If you or DP weren't scum, it would go like this: I get you and DP lynched and kill two more, and then we're to LyLo with me vs two other people. Either way, people will probably realize that I was lying the while time because I was wrong twice and they'll lynch me. It gets worse if I get jailed or checked.

mastahcheese:

Here's a better answer to Grak: I'm careful in what I do, and so I tend to vote a bit later than other people unless I'm reasonably certain in my vote (like now). Also, I was much worse at keeping my vote in one place in previous games.

Also, I wrote about myself because 1. I wanted to be thorough and 2. I wanted to get some evidence in to use when 4maskwolf got mad at me.

What do other people think of my logic?

[4maskwolf]

0. why thank you, I just love to be told that I am illogical.
1. Ah, and I suppose that you would excuse Tiruin in The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly, but not me.  Interesting logic, let's see if it makes any damn sense.  Oh wait.  It doesn't.
2. I did not blatantly misinterperet your post, I merely turned it around on you.  I see you don't like that, hmm?  Also, bullshit: I voiced legitimate reasons to go after Persus outside of RVS.
3. I said yesterdays votes, in case you can't read.  Also, bullshit.  LARD had voted for him as Solymr, you realize?  Or are you just blind?
4. I would have had to to respond, no?
5. You apparently didn't read a word I said.  You know that you can get them lynched, but they are new players.   So you are going after the veteran, in order to try and crack him.
6. Your reasons are basically "I'm too damn lazy to scumhunt him so I'm saying he's fine."
7. Yes, yes it is.  That's why I didn't vote, now did I.
8. So a slight wording change is the reason you're voting me, hmm?  That is so ridiculous.  Find someone to do your scumhunting for you in the future.
9. A liar, such bullshit, wow.  Who will be left to call you on it?  You aren't going to kill DP, you're going to save him for lylo as an easy target.  Please try to play scum with a modicum of intelligence in the future.  Thank you.

[4maskwolf]

REQUESTING REPLACEMENT
If you want to throw insults at someone, I'm sure the next player will be happy to take them. I, however, will restrict myself to running games, where people aren't going to insult me regularly. Enjoy your game.

[Tiruin]

PFP

REQUESTING REPLACEMENT
If you want to throw insults at someone, I'm sure the next player will be happy to take them. I, however, will restrict myself to running games, where people aren't going to insult me regularly. Enjoy your game.

Sorry for lacking presence D:

> Calm down...and take the situation as a note against what is presented--and not against your whole being.
*hugs* ;__;
Remember what I said about being reactionary a bit back before? Focus on something else for the next five minutes

Spoiler: Think of it this way. You're the cat... (click to show/hide)

If you do notice something is wrong with the other, act on it. Reacting comes later. Acting comes first.