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[Scoops Novel]

A 5-hour playthrough pandemic-style Sauron simulator, girls and boys. Mebbe toady can crib something from this for the villain arc. http://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=41735.0

Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/kingdinosaurgames/that-which-sleeps

85000 for a goal of 12000. You've earned it, judging by 67 pages of questions and answers

[ScriptWolf]

Seems there is information all over the place more info here http://www.indiedb.com/games/that-which-sleeps/news not posted on the blog above

[Jopax]

Kinda similar to that AI game. You build up power while trying to stay hidden from forces that can destroy you.

Also interesting take on the idea, not many evil sims these days it seems.

[Cthulhu]

This looks pretty sweet.

I've complained about it before, it seems like whenever people try to do a "villain simulator" video game it's goofy tongue in cheek bullshit.  Overlord, Dungeon Keeper, etc. etc.  I think it's because video game developers are generally incapable of subtlety.  I don't think a lot of devs could make a "serious" villain simulator without being overly violent or offensive or just generally hideous (See the ridiculously over the top Dark Brotherhood in Oblivion for a good example of what happens when video game developers try to play it straight.)

I'd really like to see someone play the idea straight for once and do it right and this seems like what I've been hoping for.  Still not getting hyped until something playable comes out of it though.  I appreciate that it seems like they dropped the announcement pretty well into development, instead of showing us pre-pre-pre-alpha vapor.

[darkflagrance]

So I was testing something particular and plowed ahead with trying to get the Fringe civilizations to unify under one of my agents, and the Grand Alliance had formed... I noticed that the Necromancers and Lizardmen kingdoms had joined them... and they were republics???

How did this happen.... so I went back and checked all the logs.  It appears that the Necromancers got a random event that ports can get that gave them a trade route, AI for trade routes had always been written for Civilized Cultures so they started to act like that with their trade route.  They formed a route with the Golden Republic of Toln, and used the trade to get better relations.  Eventually the Gold Coin merchant company expanded there, giving them a second trade route, which they created with the Lizardmen kingdom which had formed prior based on a Quest.  While I passed turns focused on the Fists of Errus plotline they all gained relations, approaching the cultural bound and the threshold for "Cultured Civilzation Revolution", and at some point reformed into republics, forming a close alliance with Aventura and Toln.  The Wayfarer's Adventurers Guild even opened a branch in lizardman capital, spawning a lizardman hero.

The designers seem to aiming for the same kind of "procedural story generation" that dwarf fortress has. That makes it worth watching, in my opinion. To be honest, this game will probably be made or broken based on the depth and novelty of its generated narratives. It's a more fleshed out experience, being the villain when the heroes, rulers, and civilians have lives, goals, and dreams that you're crushing instead of just numbers.

[Farce]

Hype acquired.  Will wait impatiently.

[nenjin]

This looks pretty sweet.

I've complained about it before, it seems like whenever people try to do a "villain simulator" video game it's goofy tongue in cheek bullshit.  Overlord, Dungeon Keeper, etc. etc.  I think it's because video game developers are generally incapable of subtlety.  I don't think a lot of devs could make a "serious" villain simulator without being overly violent or offensive or just generally hideous (See the ridiculously over the top Dark Brotherhood in Oblivion for a good example of what happens when video game developers try to play it straight.)

I'd really like to see someone play the idea straight for once and do it right and this seems like what I've been hoping for.  Still not getting hyped until something playable comes out of it though.  I appreciate that it seems like they dropped the announcement pretty well into development, instead of showing us pre-pre-pre-alpha vapor.

I think it has somewhat to do with the late 80s, 90s ideas about what can get sold without protest that still linger today. Lots of games have come out that are practically sociopath simulators....but it's always a product of the simulation rather than a deliberate thematic attempt. And I think that's the line. Developers are fine with creating games that allow stuff like this, it's really committing to the theme of playing a truly evil character that everyone is gunshy about. It's the humor or the half-warm commitment to playing an evil character that stops them from being labeled as disturbed or pushing a socially unacceptable theme.

And yet somehow, we've still managed to see a series of games with.....really unpleasant themes in the indie scene. Why there is no middle ground, I don't know. I'd think someone that made a good game that allowed us to play an evil character, without undercutting its own theme, would do very well. Personally, I've always wanted to play a Lord of the Rings-esqe game where you play Sauron, commanding his dark armies, rather than playing the heroes trying to stop him.

Dominions 4 actually allows for this sort of thing...but again....all of the theme is presented up front in the nation and god descriptions. All the terrible things you can do past that point are really just flavorless aspects of the simulation. I dunno. I guess when you stare into the Abyss long enough, it stares back into you and I think that's something a lot of devs deal with when they try to make games based around evil characters or villains.

[Cthulhu]

Dammit, I'm letting myself get very hyped.  I promised myself I wouldn't do that.

It's definitely something you have to carefully maneuver around.  I think Neonivek said it once and when I think about it it's pretty accurate, that the idea of a "villain" is inherently a little cartoonish and lends itself to that kind of chiaroscuro where you can be over the top silly or over the top obscene but middle ground is hard to find. 

Dominions is pretty good for playing the villain to some extent yeah, though the multiplayer balance aspects sour it a little bit.  Sometimes I like playing the unstoppable villain against grossly outmatched foes, sometimes I don't really want a fair fight.  I used to play the skirmish mode of Jedi Outcast as a decked-out Sith Lord solo against a team of low-level jedi (The jedi academy moviebattles mod actually made this kind of asymmetrical combat possible in multiplayer somehow.  I've beaten players of equal or better skill 2v1 before just by the nature of the combat system)

There's apparently going to be a kickstarter soon but it sounds like it's mainly to develop some original art assets instead of using campaign cartographer stuff.  I think the current artstyle looks great but that's a good way to do a kickstarter. 

I said it before and I'll say it again, I really appreciate that this guy has clearly put a lot of work into the game before he started hyping it.  The progress bar is at 80% and it seems like it's mostly just in need of polish and art and that kind of thing.  I'm sick of finding cool "in-development" games where it soon becomes obvious it's just an amateur dev puttering around with something that'll never actually get done.  I might actually back this one, show some support for proper, responsible developer practices.

[Vattic]

PTW.

[TempAcc]

PTW

[SharpKris]

PTW

[sjm9876]

Damnit, this is awesome 0_0

The game looks brilliant, it looks like mechanically complete, and the dev seems to know what he's talking about. Hell, he even admits to having compromised, which is always a pretty good sign.

[KingDinosaurGames]

Hey guys,

Dev here - was extremely happy and humbled to see some of the positive statements about TWS - which my friend and I have been working pretty diligently on for the better part of this year. 

We've mostly tried to keep it quiet up until now because we wanted a playable demo before we really got the word out - but since a few of the gaming sites picked us up we are making it a priority to be an active participant in some of the discussions happening in and around the creation of the game.

So let me know if you had any questions - I'll try to check in from time to time but please keep in mind I'm working full time and spending almost all of my waking time coding.  I'm not sure if its ok to post links here or not but you can google the project name or my username to sign up for our newsletter if you just want to hear from us when the game is released.

[ductape]

looks amazing, I LOVE MAPS!

I ams ure you know about this, but theres some really awesome map artists here: http://www.cartographersguild.com/content/

[ScriptWolf]

Yay hello dev I have a few questions.

1) how many agent types will we have ? And what happens when we turn a hero into our of our agents do we then have a *hero class* agent what about turning rulers into agents as well?

2) you mention in one of your updates about turning a thief's guild into a assassins guild does this mean that from the 4 arch types guilds will evolve and turn into sub types ? ( even without your intervention? )

3) can we play the game with no ending ? Your game seems like you could just keep pressing turns and have fun watching the world change and evolve even without you tinkering with it.