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[Madman198237]

Yes, it is a revision.

It'd be updating lamellar to have more complete coverage. Actually, it'd likely be upgrading scale armor as well, since adamantine scales won't have the not-very-strong disadvantages of steel or copper scales.

Basically, we have the armor tech. But more mages is more mages, but they're GETTING KILLED. Better adamantine, even without an armor revision, means MORE MAGES because our armor will protect them from mage-hunters' bows, shrapnel, and even handcannon shots, far more effectively than we do at present. Basically, the academy runs the risk that they increase the numbers of handcannons deployed (Every Arstotzkan with a hand cannon?) and then we lose everything. Improving adamantine to the point where a reasonable armor thickness can protect against handcannon rounds is our best bet for having more effective strength with mages AND regular infantry.


Or, you know, he's forgotten about it already and he's not going to get to it til tomorrow. Personally, I'm hoping that's the case, because I think people need to see this discussion before voting.

[Egan_BW]

I still think it's vital that we use the revision for Defy Resistance. Lightning rods were mentioned many times in the last turn, and seem to have been the major factor that turned the advantage away from us winning every theatre.
Better metal would be very good here, but more mages is pretty much a straight upgrade to everything we do, so I'll settle for either but would prefer the mythril.

(5) Magical Academy: detoxicated, Kashyyk, NUKE9.13, Happerry, Taricus,
(4) Mithril: Madman198237, AC, khang36, Egan_BW
(0) Anti-Crystal Sonic Shells:

Yes, I'm flip-flopping. It's my right.

[Taricus]

Madman, I think you may've burnt people out on discussion

[Madman198237]

_{My plans for Arms Race domination advance!}
*ahem*

Nothing, nothing at all.


But seriously, I would much rather see advanced adamantine, then the mages to wear it, rather than the other way around. After all, nobody wants to see naked Moskurger mages doing cartwheels in front of batteries of Arstotzkan handcannons.

[Egan_BW]

Last turn we started getting shot at by small arms and started getting into melee. This is why I think it's a good idea to upgrade metal now, because better armor and better melee weapons will solve both these problems. Better metal is what we need now, more mages is something that could help us anytime.

[Detoxicated]

Name the academy after the daughter of the sultan...

[Kashyyk]

More mages means more lightning, ballista, siroccos, airships and carpets, which will all reduce the number of arstotzkans reaching us in melee. At that point it won't matter if we're not using mythril because we'll have a numbers advantage.

[Madman198237]

We HAVE a numbers advantage.

It's not doing enough.


You like the numbers advantage? So do I. Upgrading adamantine helps everything. We won't get more carpets, airships, Siroccos, or ballistae (Though we will get more ACCURATE ballistae) because those are being operated to the limits of production, not to the limits of the availability of mages.

However, we can turn our airships, Siroccos, mages, soldiers, and weapons into armored killing machines by upgrading adamantine to the level of toughness it needs.

[NUKE9.13]

We won't get more carpets, airships, Siroccos, or ballistae because those are being operated to the limits of production, not to the limits of the availability of mages.

That's not true. eS has stated multiple times that we are short on mages, and are thus for example fielding less ballistae than we could.

I think we could create improved armour with a revision (albeit not something on the level of Arstotzka's platemail), which could increase the survivability of our mages. Alternatively, we could amp up Cyclone Shield to the point where it can deflect handcannon rounds. Or we could finally make Detect Snipers, which would also deal with their mage-hunters.

[Atomic Chicken]

All right, everyone's made good, solid arguments in favour of the two leading designs. I don't think there's much to be added beyond what's already been said, so how about letting this cool off for a while? It looks like we're dangerously close to entering the forbidden salt zone at the moment.

[Madman198237]

I don't think so.


NUKE, it WAS mentioned that we're underutilizing ballistae. I forgot when writing that the ballistae presently need mages to keep up the enchantments. However, we will not get more carpets, airships, or Siroccos, because the Sirocco is fully utilized (No competition for mage-use at sea, and each theater is independent), the airships are VE because of technical reasons, and the carpets and airships are the things drawing mages away from ballistae.

So all we might gain is some ballistae, which are presently outranged for the most part. When Arstotzka makes its infantry advantages, ballistae require a near-direct hit to get enough of the Firestorm goo on enemies to cook them.

Yes, AC, most of the arguments have been made and we're mostly pointlessly going back and forth over what's more valuable. It'd basically require both of us to outline our entire methodologies in order to spot further problems or points of contention. For instance: NUKE explained his reasoning by saying that we're short of mages, and therefore get more of everything with more mages. I can now refute that, because I know WHY he thinks that is the case.

[evictedSaint]

Design: Magical Academy [6+1, 2-1, 3+1]

After the flounderimg attempt to improve the education of our mages a couple years ago, we take the time to actually set up a dedicated Academy to teach young minds how to control the gifts given to them by Allsh.

Unlike Arstotzka's Academy for Adequate Apprenticeship, Moskurg's Apprentice Gramary for Inter-magical Competency focuses more on improving the apprentices that we do have rather than gaining new ones.  By using our mind-linking magic, a single professor can impart his knowledge into up to two dozen students at once over the course of a week.  Naturally, education is no replacement for practical training, but M.A.G.I.C. gives the students enough of a foundation to be more comptetent than a traditional apprentice.  Students of this Gramary quickly gain the ability to cast wizard-level spells after only a little bit of training and can generally pass the exam to gain the title of a Full-Fledged Wizard.  Due to the method in which we educate the apprentices, the school doesn't exactly increase the number of magic users we have as it does increase their skill level.

Currently, the only person approved to impart his wisdom on the fresh, younge minds is al-Mutriqa, who returns from the front for a week or two each year to accelerate the training of the next batch of Apprentices.  Apprentices trained by this fanatical, rather crazed individual themselves tend to gain a rather reckless demeanor towards magic, but our Researcher Priests assure us that it's nothing to be worried about.

Because al-Mutriqa is the only one who can train these young minds, the Gramary is a National Effort.

[Egan_BW]

(1) Defy Resistance Egan_BW

I really want this.

[Madman198237]

How about this (Better use, AND better fluff! Who doesn't love it?)

Heretics' Downfall
Those who wish to control the weather have always done so through the power of Allah. Those that control this power without doing so are, therefore, heretics and must die. This change to our lightning spells will do that. By adding direction and purpose to the bolts, the purpose of destroying the Arstotzkan unbelievers and the direction to do so, the Spear and the Hammer both seek out crystal constructs rather than metal, striking them directly, and striking crystal far more often than anything or anywhere else.

Basically, I want to redirect lightning, but I want to do it with style.
Plus this turns the Hammer into what amounts to the Spear on steroids (Calls down MORE LIGHTNING, and now has rudimentary crystal-seeking guidance!) and should allow us to annihilate all their cannons. And their infantry. And everything else they ever wanted to not watch die in a blaze of heavenly glory and death.

[NUKE9.13]

So... does being a National Effort mean we only get a handful more mages, or does it mean we can 'deploy' al-Mutriqa to the school to get a decent amount more?

Anyway. You're worried about our mages getting sniped? We can deal with that problem.

Detect Sniper: Much like ambushes are detected by Detect Ambush, Detect Sniper... detects snipers. Because really, what is a sniper but a long-ranged ambusher?
The spell is designed to be relatively easy to cast, and pick up on the 'sniper mindset' emanating from potential snipers at up to long range. Once detected, the mage has a wealth of options available to him; a rightful blasting with Spear of Allah, sending a cavalry patrol to run down the intruder, or simply relocate to a less vulnerable position.

(1) Defy Resistance Egan_BW
(1) Detect Sniper: NUKE9.13