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Author Topic: BYOR 15: Game Over - Mafia Win (Kinda?)  (Read 112803 times)

notquitethere

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #375 on: December 26, 2020, 05:28:41 pm »

Too many players to keep track of. Corrected list, downgrading IcyTea:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Nirur Torir

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #376 on: December 26, 2020, 05:37:14 pm »

Unvote.
I'm not getting an answer, the purpose of the vote, but at least Owl's doing more now. Good enough.
Gut said inexperienced townish with a strange play style. After their newest posts, I'm even more confused, but don't think they're the most lynchable person right now.

Nirur, thanks for replacing in. Who is scum?
I'm trying to work up the will for a more detailed re-read.

If I had to vote now, I'm really suspicious of Tric's "If Tea wasn't scum, they'd trust me with the hat that would make me a doctor. Also I can get badges to disable kills." claims, especially followed by their jump to bandwagoning Owl.
I don't want to vote now, in case of vote manipulation shenanigans causing an early hammer.
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Luckyowl

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #377 on: December 26, 2020, 05:38:31 pm »

I won't say my action on TricMagic does. But I'll tell you my action on IcyTea31 does once I get some clarification on it from Webadict.
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Luckyowl

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #378 on: December 26, 2020, 05:41:56 pm »

The reason I won't say what my ability will do on TricMagic is so the Mafia don't get any information on what I'm capable of. TricMagic can even confirm the action once it gets through.
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TricMagic

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #379 on: December 26, 2020, 05:46:02 pm »

Fair enough on that.
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Vector

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #380 on: December 26, 2020, 05:48:55 pm »

PFP. NQT, hard to believe that your “might go somewhere” list largely consists of the bandwagon on LuckyO, who screams noob *something*. Given your comment directly afterwards, do I correctly understand that you prefer LO for the D1 lynch?

I will add a couple of things.

1., given what I have seen so far I am not sure there is a traditional scumteam. There are a lot of players acting nuts and it is hard for me to believe that people would not be bellowing at them for this in scumchat. I know this is WIFOM, but still: there is a surprisingly large number of people with bizarre and uncoordinated anti-town behavior. Maybe the scumteam is small?

2. The point re third parties is taken and very suitable, but lynching an apparent third party is better than mislynching town D1. I would prefer to lynch scum, obviously, but pressuring until we get a 3rd-party claim is still pretty good IMHO.

3. Of the vets, I.e. people whose meta I know, Leafsnail’s ducking to the side is very consistent with his scum play (but again: Christmas). I should do a reread when I get home from groceries; I’d like to post my current observations.
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"The question of the usefulness of poetry arises only in periods of its decline, while in periods of its flowering, no one doubts its total uselessness." - Boris Pasternak

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notquitethere

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #381 on: December 26, 2020, 06:00:33 pm »

For me, towniness of cases is more about the reasons and the circumstances of the votes than whether they're actually right. Town are wrong more times than not. As such, I don't particularly favour a Lucky Owl lynch. Their recent openness about targeting people (which happened after I did my read through) is especially a bold move that I don't really peg as scum. I'm waiting to see what people do.

Additional reflection: I also don't really think Tric's case on Owl is strong, but Tric has been wielding their vote actively, which I tend to read as pretty town-sided.

3rd party vote on d1 is OK, not ideal as less informative, but OK. And it's not a trick that can be repeated.



Nirur, that's pretty nonsense reason not to vote. 9 votes is hammer. I think the biggest wagon is three votes. Get real.
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Nirur Torir

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #382 on: December 26, 2020, 06:18:59 pm »

Nirur, that's pretty nonsense reason not to vote. 9 votes is hammer. I think the biggest wagon is three votes. Get real.
With this far to go I don't think it important to have a vote down for the sake of it, but feel free to write me in on the Tric bandwagon with (afraid to vote) if it makes you happy.
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Leafsnail

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #383 on: December 26, 2020, 06:49:32 pm »

I don't really get the question? This kinda makes me feel that way, but in the game no, I've never had that happen to me before. Besides that 'Everyone Scum' game after it ended, but that's mostly cause my playstyle was completely wrong because of it.
Ok, I guess I will try again. You immediately bought an item from the shop without providing any reason for doing so. You then, without anyone having challenged you over it, provided an explanation for why you did so. To me that seems self-conscious in a way I wouldn't expect a town player to be. I'd like to hear about why you felt the need to make the second clarifying post.
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Leafsnail

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #384 on: December 26, 2020, 07:18:33 pm »

Re: ICT's "slip":
I have knowledge town doesn't have.
This is phrased weirdly but I think given the context of his previous post it's pretty clear that he meant knowledge the town as a whole doesn't have. He went on to clarify what he meant.

Out of the people who moved on this I found Vector's posts rubbed me the wrong way.
As far as the slip goes, I've seen this kind of thing both reveal the scumteam and offer an excuse for scum to bandwagon. If we lynched ICT today, and I were alive in a couple of days, I expect that I would examine anyone with a last-minute bandwagon over the slip later.
This in particular strikes me as pretty weaselly, especially given that Vector supports Jim's case in the previous paragraph. It's strangely noncommittal - not settling on whether the scumslip is real, and leaving open the door to go after other people who do believe it's real (while leaving in the bandwagon as a caveat). This feels like a pretty calculated response to what should be a straightfoward question.
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heydude6

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #385 on: December 26, 2020, 07:21:27 pm »

Toaster

Heydude:  Just so we're absolutely 100% crystal clear with no room for other interpretation, variation, or change of claim later, you got your message about being contracted at this point in the game, and not earlier in the day?  I want absolute confirmation on this.

No, I received it at this point, shorty after your big post, but before your follow-up question to Jim.

I spelled it out pretty clearly the first time I said it:
In other words, someone just maliciously targeted me with a day action. It was at 10:02:06 pm, which is 1 minute and 2 seconds after Toaster's post. I think I must have been doing too good of job as town then.



Why are you so sure scum hit you with that ability and not a townie who monumentally distrusts you?

Read monumentally as momentarily for a second.

Do you really think these two posts have anything excessively scummy in them? Especially when you compare it to someone like Fallacy and Iceytea?

It was quite a powerful ability. If it weren't for the "Leave a Comment" loophole, they would have crippled me and thus the town's first night at the very least. Whoever used this ability was pretty damn confident that it wouldn't be wasted and hurt their own team. That kind of confidence would only come from someone who is scum.



Iceytea, it was a pretty good response. I thought most of your points were good, so I only responded to the bits that I felt needed further commentary.

Spoiler: More Iceytea (click to show/hide)
Quote
I still find it strange that two contracts have been sent though. Usually you can only use an ability once per phase, but I wouldn't put it past the mafia to coordinate something funky.
I'm more concerned that it seems to be a double-targeting killing ability. I think the sender is more likely an SK than mafia, actually.

Flavourwise, it doesn't seem like the kind of ability that would be double-target. I'm pretty sure that the double-target part was the result of some other ability or even an item. As a result, I have doubts about them working alone.

Hey TricMagic! Do one of your hats allow someone to use an ability twice?
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TricMagic

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #386 on: December 26, 2020, 07:24:22 pm »

I don't really get the question? This kinda makes me feel that way, but in the game no, I've never had that happen to me before. Besides that 'Everyone Scum' game after it ended, but that's mostly cause my playstyle was completely wrong because of it.
Ok, I guess I will try again. You immediately bought an item from the shop without providing any reason for doing so. You then, without anyone having challenged you over it, provided an explanation for why you did so. To me that seems self-conscious in a way I wouldn't expect a town player to be. I'd like to hear about why you felt the need to make the second clarifying post.

In this case, being open. However! That is simply because I could be. On it's own, this badge is of little use to me. With the right hat or badge, it becomes useful. And unlike the rest, I do get regular income of 100 pons. I don't have much reason to put the 1-Hit Hero badge in circulation. The Hookshot badge negates random, redirect, and tracking, which kinda makes my own hat a bit pointless.

The best three badges for everyone depending on ability. No Bonk which negates any kill action you make once, Hover that prevents you from using abilities that would end up killing you, and Compass. There is another called Projectile Badge, but extra night actions don't mean much to me.
Granted, you'd need to trust my descriptions of things. I'm mostly hoping no one kills me by this point. LO's targeting of me is the kind of thing I was hoping to avoid. Hopefully it's fine.

Right now Icytea has a useful hat of mine I would like back, by lynch or by gift. 2/3 odds are very good.



Nin. I mostly want my hats so my actions are at full power. I can use up to 3 Hats per night. 2/3s of the unknown would improve my survival tremendously. As is if I don't have them by end of the day I'm going to reveal their abilities, which almost guarantees my death. They should know what they do, so if they are keeping one of them it's kinda scummy and easy to see.



Nin heydude.

None of my hats give use of two abilities at once, that's the Projectile Badge. And they're all Night Hats anyway, I checked.
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FallacyofUrist

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #387 on: December 26, 2020, 07:24:45 pm »

NQT:

FoU
I recall from previous games that you do a lot of voting analysis based on past days. Stuff like seeing who a scum player voted for after their death and comparing that to their posts, or reviewing cases made by dead town. How useful do you think that'll be this game?
Given how chaotic role powers are going to be, looking at who voted who is likely to be much more useful information than trying to untangle the night game. Do you disagree?
You do have a point there. Well, more precisely, it's more likely to be reliable. If I hypothetically have some investigative power, it can be blocked, redirected, misled, stolen, or shidazzled, but Wuba's said himself that post editing will never be a thing. None of these fancy powers are going to mess with the votecount record, and due to being reliable it's also useful. That said, the votecount record can't act like an investigative ability. I'm not going to learn the truth about Tricmagic's hat nonsense from the votecount record.

I'd ask you for your current suspicions, but from the looks of things you're still working on that, and I don't want to be a hypocrite.


LuckyOwl:
FOU: It was obvious bait to get a conversation going.  Which is such a townie vet thing to do. It's sort of his play style that I picked up from BP3. So I know he's definitely townie.
Matey. That don't jive. All it takes is scum!Tea deciding 'hey I'm gonna do this as a gambit to make people think I'm town' and your argument gets you a false read.

The most reliable reads are based on multitudes of evidence, not one single point.

You taste more like new town, though, so I'll give you a pass for today. No fries for you.

Toony:
Are you absolutely sure? I assume you're referring to Beetlejuice here. Beelzebub is not exactly the same as Beetlejuice. I will say his name only twice to be safe.
I might actually try the 'say three times' thing to see if it's real or not. Could be fun.

Torir-iel:
And you didn't even answer it. I want to know how you'll know how to use your abilities, in this case by finding the "something like a mayor" to protect, when you're relying on the night game and gambits. But by now you've answered it well enough I think: People who draw your ire by attacking you get hit with soggy fries.
Yes! Exactly! Well. Not quite.

'People who draw my ire' is correct. 'By attacking me' is not. If anything, attacking me is a good thing, because it means they're paying attention. People who draw my ire by acting as what I see as scummy will receive soggy useless very bad fries.

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FoU has some twisted role ideas. Screw second-guessing this mechanical garbage spaghetti, I'm basing everything on reads and visible daytime behaviour.

Would you like to play a game of Mafia? The subforum is always open to new players.

TricMagic

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #388 on: December 26, 2020, 07:29:03 pm »

I halfway get the feeling FoU would love the 1-Hit Badge. To give with their fries before sending them to the afterlife behind the walls.
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FallacyofUrist

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Re: BYOR 15: Day 1 - The Badge Seller
« Reply #389 on: December 26, 2020, 07:35:06 pm »

Ay, Tric.

Actually. TricMagic.

It's not that I think you're scum (though I may later update my position) and it'll be a while before the day ends so I have some leeway to move my vote around. But I think I want more information on your votes, and a vote on you for the moment might help with that.

Why're you voting for LuckyOwl right now, and why were you voting for IcyTea before then?

Jim Groovester, ToonyMan, 4maskwolf, I also have my eyes on y'all.
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FoU has some twisted role ideas. Screw second-guessing this mechanical garbage spaghetti, I'm basing everything on reads and visible daytime behaviour.

Would you like to play a game of Mafia? The subforum is always open to new players.
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