Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Orangebottle]

Indeed. Yet the whole point is that it was RVS. RVS. RVS.RVS. Jsut waiting for it to sink in your head. RVS.RVS. Should be fine now i hope.

RVS does not excuse terrible questions. Have you played a beginner's game before? Apparently not, because you would've seen something like this:

Ideally you should ask game related questions in the RVS. Asking what kind of flavor of ice cream is a player's favorite does absolutely nothing to help you find scum, which is your primary goal.

Oh hey, he wrote bussing instead of tunneling. I should disregard that it's pretty evident what he mean, and also that he did wrote tunneling 2 times elsewhere.

No, it really isn't.

Insult ? Nah. They are more remarks. And as in the quote, yes, stupidity makes me angry. Thus the remarks.

An insult by any other name...

Would still be an insult.

Well if they are so numerous why cant you even find one and post it, we have plenty of time. Please be cooperative, i can't wait to see what you will come up with.

Find one? Ok.

Where are these 'fallacious argument' you keep referring to?

There's one. One relevant question. Want more? I have dozens waiting.

And finally, stating the blatantly oblivious, especially when it has been stated earlier, does not count as being active. Parroting since you failed to add anything remotely relevant. Nolynching is a loss of a day ? Golly jeepers, i would never have guessed it. Except i did.

So, what? Are you accusing me of active lurking now? That's what it looks like.

[Mysteriousbluepuppet]

Quote from: Orangebottle on Today at 07:35:34 pm
Where are these 'fallacious argument' you keep referring to?
There's one. One relevant question. Want more? I have dozens waiting.


2nd part was answered earlier.  Faulty reasoning, all your shit on rvs. and all that.

Should I repeat myself a 4th time ?

[webadict]

MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.

[Orangebottle]

MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.

What started as me telling MBP to not ask ridiculous RVS questions snowballed into some huge shitfling. It gave everyone plenty to look at, though.

If he wants to continue it, he can. If he can find something to go off of.
Webadict: Why is TolyK scum again? Because of bad word choice?

[webadict]

MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.

What started as me telling MBP to not ask ridiculous RVS questions snowballed into some huge shitfling. It gave everyone plenty to look at, though.

If he wants to continue it, he can. If he can find something to go off of.
Webadict: Why is TolyK scum again? Because of bad word choice?

It gave nobody anything, actually. It'll likely be completely ignored.

And, partially. Of the quoted post, his word choice was bad. In other posts, however, I find his word choice to be contrived and non-confrontational.

[Orangebottle]

MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.

What started as me telling MBP to not ask ridiculous RVS questions snowballed into some huge shitfling. It gave everyone plenty to look at, though.

If he wants to continue it, he can. If he can find something to go off of.
Webadict: Why is TolyK scum again? Because of bad word choice?

It gave nobody anything, actually. It'll likely be completely ignored.

And, partially. Of the quoted post, his word choice was bad. In other posts, however, I find his word choice to be contrived and non-confrontational.

...
I was expecting something more.
And you're fully ready to lynch him over poor word choice?

[TolyK]

I want to have a more laid-back game, though that probably won't work now
I think everyone needs to be questioned, but i'm guessing the more experienced players (Think, Irony, Wuba, Person, and the like). I know Jack AT is a good mafia-side player (from being on the same team as him before ) so questioning him might help too.

I notice you failed to list yourself. Why is that?

I don't consider myself experienced  but ask me all you want. I see you might be implying that I'm afraid of questions... 

How many 3rd parties? and Yes

Ah... With 18 people? I'm thinking like 4-5 scum, 3-4 third party, and the rest town. Though I'm not to familiar with BYOR, so these are pretty much wild guesses.

TolyK: Why give a hint to your role?  Or was that not meant to be serious?

It had a  -face, it was just a joke.

And Andrew425, I never played with you before. Who would be your favorite scummate?

Probably Think0028, he ran the beginners mafia and would probably be good to have on the team.

TolyK
Would you rather be an SK or a vigilante?

I'd rather be a vigilante, since I would win if town won, and i wouldn't really have to be alive.
Though I can just pew pew as an sk... though probably still vig.

Also, why did you remove my name from the above quote, then ask me back?

TolyK. The joke things was allowable, but your SK vs. Vig reply is unacceptable. You are claiming you would win if town won as if you yourself are not town. You also consider the sk as if you already are an sk.

This would probably be because I wrote it within a period of like 30 minutes (off and on) and so my words weren't written coherently. Big deal. "Can" to "could" and it's good.

Meaning you had less time to consider word choice. And just because the "can" COULD have been "could" does not make it so. It'd be like "I will mafiakill Mr.Person" instead of "I would mafiakill Mr.Person". So, yes, it is a big deal.

First!
Alright, Wuba, how do you think flavor will be thrown around?

Why do I care?

Answer the question please. Me no like dodgy.

The question is stupid for a myriad of reasons, not the first being "Do I look like a mind reader?" Seriously, this question is a waste of bytes and brain power. It literally answers nothing and teaches you that I really hate stupid questions. So, if you can explain how this particular question adequately amounts to anything, then I will answer the question.

Otherwise, NO. I will not answer stupid questions on principal unless there is a really good reason to.

At least this time you explained your logic. It was basically an RVS, and has at least as much reason as "what color are you thinking of?" in a mafia game.
Also, for the record, I've not been in an English-speaking country for about 1.5 years. Which sucks. 

[Think0028]

Webadict: Fair enough. Unvote.

Simple: Ottofar, because he's never cooperative. I'm trying my best to recalibrate my scum-o-meter on him so I don't automatically flail at him every time I play with him. Also Dariush and NUKE because both their playstyles and their reactions to each other mean I can do jack shit with them D1, my mental vision gets too clogged up.

ECrownofFire: What's up with calling out Irony's question loaded and then refusing to comment when called out on it? Trying to stay on the sidelines and stir up trouble?

[ECrownofFire]

ECrownofFire: What's up with calling out Irony's question loaded and then refusing to comment when called out on it? Trying to stay on the sidelines and stir up trouble?

I didn't feel it needed anything more than a comment on it. It's not really such a massive scumtell that I'd go right after him.

[webadict]

MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.

What started as me telling MBP to not ask ridiculous RVS questions snowballed into some huge shitfling. It gave everyone plenty to look at, though.

If he wants to continue it, he can. If he can find something to go off of.
Webadict: Why is TolyK scum again? Because of bad word choice?

It gave nobody anything, actually. It'll likely be completely ignored.

And, partially. Of the quoted post, his word choice was bad. In other posts, however, I find his word choice to be contrived and non-confrontational.

...
I was expecting something more.
And you're fully ready to lynch him over poor word choice?

You don't seem the least bit upset over accomplishing nothing, OrangeBottle. Nor following up your questioning with something useful.

And quit being an idiot. Of course I'm not fully ready to lynch TolyK. I'm just shoving him around a bit.

[Dariush]

Dariush, who do you think we should lynch D1?

Nuke, definitely Nuke.

Why?

See below.

I want to have a more laid-back game, though that probably won't work now
I think everyone needs to be questioned, but i'm guessing the more experienced players (Think, Irony, Wuba, Person, and the like). I know Jack AT is a good mafia-side player (from being on the same team as him before ) so questioning him might help too.

Okay, that's definitely the wrong kind of answer. Why do you think questioning experienced players would give different results?

Nuke, let's look into this uber-awesome scheme of yours. We don't lynch anybody, night passes. Some people are killed, maybe a cop or a tracker get a result. What next? Continue no-lynching? Or do you expect to get enough information from the night's events to nail scum?

[TolyK]

Dariush, who do you think we should lynch D1?

Nuke, definitely Nuke.

Why?

See below.

I want to have a more laid-back game, though that probably won't work now
I think everyone needs to be questioned, but i'm guessing the more experienced players (Think, Irony, Wuba, Person, and the like). I know Jack AT is a good mafia-side player (from being on the same team as him before ) so questioning him might help too.

Okay, that's definitely the wrong kind of answer. Why do you think questioning experienced players would give different results?

Nuke, let's look into this uber-awesome scheme of yours. We don't lynch anybody, night passes. Some people are killed, maybe a cop or a tracker get a result. What next? Continue no-lynching? Or do you expect to get enough information from the night's events to nail scum?

Makes sense.
Questioning more experienced players imo has less of a chance of mislynching.
Folks pouring on newbtown will break them with the slightest slip, while if the experienced folks slip it's easier to get a closer-to-reality result.
This isn't saying that not everyone should be questioned - obviously we need a sampling of everybody.
 The thing is that in my experience, one person breaks down (typically a new player) and they get trampled, with a potentially helpful player down.
Nuke's no-lynch is only logical if we get a round with no scum-tells, which we might get if no-one presses with votes.
Which makes Nuke's no-lynch illogical, yeah.

[NUKE9.13]

Heh heh heh heh heh.

Orright, yeah.

Andrew425:
Ignoring people is not nice, but it is a way better reaction than the one I expected! Good job, you are off the hook.
To answer the question: What the fuck were you doing; I was trying to prove that D1 lynches are bullshit. I was expecting a panicky reaction from him, which I would respond to by stating clearly that my case was not to be taken seriously, then presenting a case which made him look like obvscum.
Happily, he ignored me, probably out of confusion. This has me inclined towards thinking that A) He's alright and B) He's maybe not scum (the chance of him being scum in my eyes has slightly decreased)

MBP.
  One: Quotes work like this. Put [ quote ][ /quote ] tags around something to quote it. Use [ quote=Name ] to attribute the quote to someone. Use the preview button (next to the post button) to check if all your quotes are working properly.
  Two: You are suffering from Mafia Dogma. This is a condition where you assume that anything which is a habit in mafia is an unbreakable law which must be done and anyone who does not obey these laws is SCUM. I would like you to think.
No Lynch. Proposing this D1- does this really make me scum? Why would I, as scum, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would I, as town, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would this, from a town perspective, actually be the right thing to do? Does this seem likely?
These are not rhetorical questions. I would really like for you to ask each of these questions to yourself. If, having internally answered each of them, you still think that I am scum, I would like you to explain why. I will then respond to this. At the moment, you have basically given me nothing to respond to. It would appear that in your eyes, I sealed my fate the moment I red'd those two words.

Orangebottle
To a degree, the same response as to MBP. To a lesser degree, though, because I get the impression that you have at the very least briefly considered what I have asked MBP to consider.
One thing you have been accosting me over: Apparently I am advocating doing nothing. I do not recall this happening. When did this happen. Have I, am I, doing nothing? I do not believe so. No Lynch does not preclude people from talking. It does not preclude people from spilling their scumguts all over the place. However, it does mean no one dies at the end.
I believe that D1 lynches often hit the wrong people. Even when one is really quite certain. In... what was it? Totem? I proposed just lynching someone at random, because it would have a higher chance of hitting scum than a well-thought out lynch. I would propose the same here, but for fear that we might lose someone interesting. (Totem, being a Meph game, was liable to be less chaotic than this one. Also I was scum and wanted everyone dead ASAP)

Person
Well, I can't really say anything against a policy lynch. Happily, as I am not playing in the manner that you wish to policy lynch against, there is no need for you to vote for me. I am playing the game. Voting no lynch is quite an aggressive action, really. Consider all the reactions it got me?
I am looking for a lynch target. However, I will not be attempting to lynch them. I will make my case, reduce their counterarguments to ashes, and then I will maintain my 'no lynch' vote, because no matter how certain I am, I have learnt that D1 certainty is worth squat.
My hope is that the person (people) I identify as probscum will be either investigated or blocked or something along those lines. And if nothing better has come up by D2, I would be all up for lynching them. My no lynch policy is merely to give everyone the chance to gather information N1 before we start killing ourselves.
I do not intend to lurk, by any definition of the word.
Your math is too specific. We don't know the numbers, and pretending we do is pointless. The level of chaos that is to be expected this game is unknown. We don't even know if there is a mafia, or if we are dealing with a cult, or if there's just an awful lot of third-parties.

Powder Miner:
You are a bandwagoning fuck and I think you are scum. The point of the reaction test has been stated. Saying I am trying to look active is stupid as I clearly actually am active.
Why did you wait until after person voted for me before voicing your concerns? Because you are bandwagoning scum, thats why.

Ottofar
Fuck you on principle. You are not org, and even if you were, org was a dick. Die in a fire.

ECrownOfFire
I see you jump in to answer a question all snappy like. Then jump out without another word. WHAT THE FUCK. Play the gosh-darned game, man.

Dariush:
No. If no one comes forwards with useful information (such as a guilty investigation result), we look at the obvious night actions (kills, possible escalation of DEFCON), analyse, in the cold dawn light (tempers having been tempered by a night of rest), the chances that obvscum from D1 actually are scum, and then we start lynching.

TolyK:
Do you, truly, really, actually believe that you (or anyone else for that matter) is good enough to pick out scum from the crowd reliably D1?
Me, I don't. This based on a long list of prior D1s where obvscum has been lynched and flipped town, whilst the scum flew completely under the radar.
So even if we get scum-tells, I strongly recommend patience, rather than jumping to string 'em up.

Responses: Done. Suspicions forthcoming.

Firstly, a big round of BLUE to all the LURKERS out there. You know who you are. You are sitting there, watching the thread, thinking 'eh, I don't have anything to add, and no one is asking me anything'. Here's what you do: post anyway. Find something to add. Not a stupid question about mechanics. Not a question at all. A statement. For example 'I think No Lynching is ok'. In dealing with the subsequent backlash, much will be learnt. Just try to keep the backlash under control, because massive shitfights just make things hard to read. Keep it constructive.
To be fair, it is the weekend, and the game has just become. Nevertheless, some people are edging into lurky territory, and it is best to nip such things at the bud. This includes:
ECoF (see above)
Darvi; came in for two posts of minimal content.
NativeForeigner: Has explained his absence, so that's ok. Still, one expects him to return in strength on monday.
Simple: One post. One post of RVS bullshit. Weekend, yes. But still. He had better be back.

Webadict on principle, because come on: he's Webadict. But seriously, I believe there was once a quote in someone's signature about how if Webadict survives the first night, he's probably scum? Yeah, that's a pretty accurate statement.

Other people: Not yet. Which is not to say I am not looking, and certainly several of my responses should provide more information.

[Dariush]

No. If no one comes forwards with useful information (such as a guilty investigation result)

Which would have happened even with a lynch on D1.

we look at the obvious night actions (kills, possible escalation of DEFCON), analyse

Analyse how? And what do you know about DEFCON? This is the second time you mention a seemingly unrelated piece of flavor.

in the cold dawn light (tempers having been tempered by a night of rest), the chances that obvscum from D1 actually are scum, and then we start lynching.

And obvscum from D2 will be scum? Don't you think that the same newbies who would have been lynched D1 would be instead simply lynched D2?

In short, I want to see two specific answers from you: 1) What do you expect to gain from the night which would differ from a normal game? 2) Why do you think that he who would have been lynched D1 wouldn't get lynched D2?

No Lynch. Proposing this D1- does this really make me scum? Why would I, as scum, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would I, as town, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would this, from a town perspective, actually be the right thing to do? Does this seem likely?

And this is just pure WIFOM.

[TolyK]

@Ninja Dariush: FUCK you took my WIFOM

Proposing this D1- does this really make me scum? Why would I, as scum, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would I, as town, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would this, from a town perspective, actually be the right thing to do? Does this seem likely?

Blatant WIFOM. As mentioned by Dariush like several seconds ago.

TolyK:
Do you, truly, really, actually believe that you (or anyone else for that matter) is good enough to pick out scum from the crowd reliably D1?

Nope.

Me, I don't. This based on a long list of prior D1s where obvscum has been lynched and flipped town, whilst the scum flew completely under the radar.

... which is what I (tried to) say.

So even if we get scum-tells, I strongly recommend patience, rather than jumping to string 'em up.

... yeah, kinda. Except that by jumping on them you get even more info/stuff to work with, which is good for me (I don't pick up subtle things too well, so more info always helps).